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On the subject of me views of Duncan Macleod as a character, and in particular (and sorta accidentally) his interactions with Methos:
Me and Duncan Macleod. Okay. First off, yes, I don't know him very well. Because of an accident of access (the person who uploaded the episodes I've seen was primarily a Methos fan, with some Joe eps in there, the occasional Amanda), most of the episodes I've seen have been the Methos eps, yes. So I've missed quite a lot of Duncan's episodes, and missed a lot of his character development/history. Which means, yes, I don't know him very well, and that's part of the reason I don't write him so much, particularly not on his own - because I wouldn't trust myself. I should probably fix that, but that's a matter of access and time. Most of where I've seen him, I've been seeing him from the POVs of people like Methos and Joe, because they're the characters I've context for on screen, and therefore the characters whose point of view I'm coming from. Okay?
From what I have seen of Duncan Macleod of the Clan Macleod, I've drawn the following impressions:
- He is young (possibly you only think this if Methos is your starting point, rather than, say, Ritchie or Tessa, but quite a lot of the other immortals we encounter are a good bit older than him). He thinks he's quite old, and in reference to the humans and his students, he is, but relatively speaking, he kinda isn't. He's ... the immortal equivalent of a man in his mid-twenties, I think, young and brash and confident, established and experienced enough to think he knows most of what he needs to know, self-aware enough (and troubled enough) to realise that there are things he doesn't.
- He is ... relatively static. Unlike most immortals beyond their second or third life, unlike even his own kinsman, Duncan doesn't change his name. He doesn't really change his ideals. He still acts like the clan defender, willing and able to destroy whoever threatens the family he's built. Duncan ... decided a long time ago, I think, that no matter how much the world changed around him, no matter how much he might have to change to fit it, he would always strive to keep as much of the man he was alive as possible. This ... causes him a lot of trouble, makes his judgments flawed, and by the later Methos eps (I'm thinking of 'The Valkyrie' in particular), he knows this. He knows that his adherance to old ideals and personalities is causing him trouble in dealing with the world around him, and he is afraid that he's going to be judged for them, perhaps rightly, in his turn. Most of the conflict in his character is him trying to decide how much to bend, and where, and being afraid that he's not bending enough, but also that someday he'll bend in the wrong place, and let some evil go that he shouldn't. Part of the reason he's so judgmental of others is that he's afraid of judgments of himself, and he does know that. (The other part being that the persona he's still clinging to, the one he was raised as, was a 16th century Scotsman - the Reformation, among other things, would have been relatively recent at the time, so ...)
- Dealing with his relationship with Methos in particular (he's judgmental of all of them, really, Amanda for her lifestyle, Joe for his allegiances, but Methos seems to be the main contention-point). I think most of the problem he has with Methos stems not from the fact that he's holding Methos to his standards, but that he's holding Methos to Darius' standards, or rather, Duncan's view of them. Which Methos is at least partially to blame for, because Methos deliberately played up the soft-gentle-sage part when they first met, to get Duncan to help him against Kalas. Add in the fact that Duncan lost Darius very soon after this (to, let's not forget, people both Methos and Joe were attached to), and his wanting Methos as a replacement Darius has a lot of impact on his later dealings with Methos and reactions to, say, the revelation that Methos used to be a ravaging genocidal maniac. Also, with Methos, Duncan had to deal with a survivor of those past predations, which I don't think he ever had to with Darius. Why Duncan is more willing to believe in the immortal equivalent of a Divine Lightning Bolt changing someone (Light Quickening) rather than the long slow process of years (Methos) is related to both the fact that Duncan is inherantly afraid of the latter kind of change anyway, and also the fact of, again, 16th century Scotsman.
In terms of the way I, personally, view Duncan ... I'm not particularly fond of him, it's true. He's not my favourite character, in particular because overtly judgmental people put my back up, for entirely personal reasons relating mostly to the fact that I know I would fail most of those judgments (rather like Duncan himself, really). *shrugs sheepishly*
However, that's a personal view of a character. As a person ... I feel kinda sorry for him. Because ... he really is stuck in a bad place, for an immortal. He's struggling, really, really hard, with the dichotomy of who he used to be, the parts of himself he wants to keep, and who he needs to be, right now, in order to survive a changing world. He's also stuck in one of the worst possible places for an immortal, in terms of age and development, because he's not young, on his first few lives, still relatively close to both the time and person he was born, the values he was raised with, but he's also not old. He hasn't had the time or experience yet to know, as Methos or Amanda or Darius does, what he can survive, how much of himself, his inner self, can survive the predations of Time, and that scares him. Not unjustifiably.
And Methos probably really, really scares him in that regard, because a) Methos changed massively, which is a good thing when you think of what he used to be, but an incredibly bad thing when you're someone like Duncan who's afraid he's going to lose the essential parts of himself over time, and b) Methos doesn't even remember who he was. So not only is Duncan going to lose who he is, he's going to forget why it matters. This, to Duncan, is a horrible, horrible thought, and I think he prefers not to have it if he can at all help it. Which leads to him dealing with Methos as if Methos is either still that person, or wasn't that person at all, because those are the only options that don't force Duncan to have to deal with the thought of that much change.
There's also the fact that, much as you can't judge Methos by Duncan's (or our) standards, you also really can't judge Duncan by Methos' (or, again, ours). Methos had five thousand years to learn to be as flexible and pragmatic as he is, and by all appearances, for quite long periods of those five millennia, he was as rigid or worse as Duncan himself (he stuck with the Horsemen for ages, remember). And I strongly suspect that it's the fact that Methos knows this that he likes and puts up with as much from Duncan as he does. He loves Mac. I think (personal view, because I don't ship them) that he loves Mac primarily as a child and a student, someone who has potential that Methos would quite like to see developed, but the fact remains that he loves him and, like Amanda, forgives the things Duncan does that hurt him for that reason.
So. Um. In summary. I don't know Duncan very well, and probably shouldn't trust myself to write him, having only seen as little of the source as I have. I don't like him very much, because he puts my back up a bit. But I also think he has reasons, pretty understandable ones, for being the way he is, and he's trying (so fucking slowly, but he is) to change, to let go of the fear long enough to change, and I would really, really hate to think I was being unfair to him just because I don't really like him -_-;
And, right. Um. Sorry about the rant-i-ness? *ducks* Sorry about that.
From what I have seen of Duncan Macleod of the Clan Macleod, I've drawn the following impressions:
- He is young (possibly you only think this if Methos is your starting point, rather than, say, Ritchie or Tessa, but quite a lot of the other immortals we encounter are a good bit older than him). He thinks he's quite old, and in reference to the humans and his students, he is, but relatively speaking, he kinda isn't. He's ... the immortal equivalent of a man in his mid-twenties, I think, young and brash and confident, established and experienced enough to think he knows most of what he needs to know, self-aware enough (and troubled enough) to realise that there are things he doesn't.
- He is ... relatively static. Unlike most immortals beyond their second or third life, unlike even his own kinsman, Duncan doesn't change his name. He doesn't really change his ideals. He still acts like the clan defender, willing and able to destroy whoever threatens the family he's built. Duncan ... decided a long time ago, I think, that no matter how much the world changed around him, no matter how much he might have to change to fit it, he would always strive to keep as much of the man he was alive as possible. This ... causes him a lot of trouble, makes his judgments flawed, and by the later Methos eps (I'm thinking of 'The Valkyrie' in particular), he knows this. He knows that his adherance to old ideals and personalities is causing him trouble in dealing with the world around him, and he is afraid that he's going to be judged for them, perhaps rightly, in his turn. Most of the conflict in his character is him trying to decide how much to bend, and where, and being afraid that he's not bending enough, but also that someday he'll bend in the wrong place, and let some evil go that he shouldn't. Part of the reason he's so judgmental of others is that he's afraid of judgments of himself, and he does know that. (The other part being that the persona he's still clinging to, the one he was raised as, was a 16th century Scotsman - the Reformation, among other things, would have been relatively recent at the time, so ...)
- Dealing with his relationship with Methos in particular (he's judgmental of all of them, really, Amanda for her lifestyle, Joe for his allegiances, but Methos seems to be the main contention-point). I think most of the problem he has with Methos stems not from the fact that he's holding Methos to his standards, but that he's holding Methos to Darius' standards, or rather, Duncan's view of them. Which Methos is at least partially to blame for, because Methos deliberately played up the soft-gentle-sage part when they first met, to get Duncan to help him against Kalas. Add in the fact that Duncan lost Darius very soon after this (to, let's not forget, people both Methos and Joe were attached to), and his wanting Methos as a replacement Darius has a lot of impact on his later dealings with Methos and reactions to, say, the revelation that Methos used to be a ravaging genocidal maniac. Also, with Methos, Duncan had to deal with a survivor of those past predations, which I don't think he ever had to with Darius. Why Duncan is more willing to believe in the immortal equivalent of a Divine Lightning Bolt changing someone (Light Quickening) rather than the long slow process of years (Methos) is related to both the fact that Duncan is inherantly afraid of the latter kind of change anyway, and also the fact of, again, 16th century Scotsman.
In terms of the way I, personally, view Duncan ... I'm not particularly fond of him, it's true. He's not my favourite character, in particular because overtly judgmental people put my back up, for entirely personal reasons relating mostly to the fact that I know I would fail most of those judgments (rather like Duncan himself, really). *shrugs sheepishly*
However, that's a personal view of a character. As a person ... I feel kinda sorry for him. Because ... he really is stuck in a bad place, for an immortal. He's struggling, really, really hard, with the dichotomy of who he used to be, the parts of himself he wants to keep, and who he needs to be, right now, in order to survive a changing world. He's also stuck in one of the worst possible places for an immortal, in terms of age and development, because he's not young, on his first few lives, still relatively close to both the time and person he was born, the values he was raised with, but he's also not old. He hasn't had the time or experience yet to know, as Methos or Amanda or Darius does, what he can survive, how much of himself, his inner self, can survive the predations of Time, and that scares him. Not unjustifiably.
And Methos probably really, really scares him in that regard, because a) Methos changed massively, which is a good thing when you think of what he used to be, but an incredibly bad thing when you're someone like Duncan who's afraid he's going to lose the essential parts of himself over time, and b) Methos doesn't even remember who he was. So not only is Duncan going to lose who he is, he's going to forget why it matters. This, to Duncan, is a horrible, horrible thought, and I think he prefers not to have it if he can at all help it. Which leads to him dealing with Methos as if Methos is either still that person, or wasn't that person at all, because those are the only options that don't force Duncan to have to deal with the thought of that much change.
There's also the fact that, much as you can't judge Methos by Duncan's (or our) standards, you also really can't judge Duncan by Methos' (or, again, ours). Methos had five thousand years to learn to be as flexible and pragmatic as he is, and by all appearances, for quite long periods of those five millennia, he was as rigid or worse as Duncan himself (he stuck with the Horsemen for ages, remember). And I strongly suspect that it's the fact that Methos knows this that he likes and puts up with as much from Duncan as he does. He loves Mac. I think (personal view, because I don't ship them) that he loves Mac primarily as a child and a student, someone who has potential that Methos would quite like to see developed, but the fact remains that he loves him and, like Amanda, forgives the things Duncan does that hurt him for that reason.
So. Um. In summary. I don't know Duncan very well, and probably shouldn't trust myself to write him, having only seen as little of the source as I have. I don't like him very much, because he puts my back up a bit. But I also think he has reasons, pretty understandable ones, for being the way he is, and he's trying (so fucking slowly, but he is) to change, to let go of the fear long enough to change, and I would really, really hate to think I was being unfair to him just because I don't really like him -_-;
And, right. Um. Sorry about the rant-i-ness? *ducks* Sorry about that.
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